Episode 3 - William from Boston - How the Camino became a deeply emotional inner journey

Danny

Hello, Bill. I’m really happy to have you here on the third episode of the Your Inner Camino Podcast, and that you want to share your story with fellow Camino pilgrims, the Camino family, and everyone listening.

I’m really happy, and also quite excited, because we met each other last year while walking the Camino. We had an insane experience, totally insane.

So, could you tell the listeners a little about who you are, where you come from, and why you walked the Camino? Then we can move into your story.

William

Sure. My name is William Walker. I was kind of forced into retirement, probably similar to your situation. I’m not sure, but I was basically forced into it. It would have been crazy not to take the deal, so I took it.

For a year, I wasn’t going to be working, but I was still getting my normal paycheck. Then I had to retire at the end of that year. I really didn’t know what I wanted to do. It was frustrating to get up in the morning and not go anywhere. I thought I was going to do something exciting, but I didn’t know what.

Then I was looking at RVs, and funny enough, I still haven’t gone back to see him yet, but the salesman was the one who told me he had just gotten back from the Camino. I said, “What is the Camino? I have no idea what that is.” I had been living here for so many years, and I had never even heard of it.

He told me all about it. He showed me the book, told me he had walked it, and showed me his certificate. He said it’s a journey people go on, and he told me to watch the movie The Way. I started learning about it, and I got so excited. I thought, I think I’m going to do this.

So I had all this time, maybe three months, to kind of put it all together. Basically, I took that deal in June, and I had that month to really figure things out. Then by August or September, I was there. I still don’t know how I pulled it all together, but it was something that seemed very exciting to me.

It started out as an adventure, or at least I thought it was going to be an adventure, kind of a gift to myself for retirement. But it became so much more. It really is hard to describe. Maybe three quarters of the way in, I realized this was far more than I had expected. It became very emotional at times.

And when I met you, that was at a power place, San Antón. It’s hard to describe what we went through there. But how could we not take the opportunity? The host suggested that we go with them in the car. We didn’t know anything. We went to see the nun sing and to go to Mass there. It was just incredible, voices like angels.

I think that was the start, the point where I really began feeling the Inner Camino for me.

And meeting you was like meeting a brother I never knew I had. We spent the whole day hiking, we stayed there, and it was just a beautiful experience. We met some wonderful people there, including you. It was quite emotional. The whole walk had certain parts, what you called power places, that were just overwhelming. It’s hard to describe.

Danny

So what happened with you? Because I remember meeting you about half an hour before we reached the ruin of the old monastery of San Antón.

We walked there together, and then that young Dutch lady came out, Angela, and Chechu as well.

William

Yes.

Danny

And then we were both overwhelmed, because actually we just wanted to...

William

They were so welcoming. It’s hard to describe, the two hosts there. It was overwhelming. I mean, how could you not hug them? They had open arms. They were hugging everybody. Anyone who came through, they just welcomed them. Very, very nice people.

Danny

What I remember is that you were very confused. In your introduction you just said that you wanted an adventure, and I still have warm feelings about this. I even need to laugh a little, not in a bad way, but because it was so beautiful. You were standing there saying, “Oh, I didn’t come for this. I didn’t come for this.” You were totally confused.

What happened with you at that moment?

William

At that moment, I was just overwhelmed. I felt like, wow, I shouldn’t be feeling all these emotions, but they just overcame me.

When we were in that church, I was crying so much. I was feeling things from my past, things coming up, seeing my parents pass away, all these emotions came up. During that Mass, I was just crying and feeling very emotional, and then hearing everybody’s stories...

We were sitting there by candlelight, and everybody was sharing their emotions. I don’t know exactly what made me pause, but my wife had recently had a stroke, so that changed what I could even do in life. Part of this journey was reflecting on that, and on having to take care of my wife almost as a caregiver. That was very hard for me, and it still is.

My daughters still live at home, so they were taking care of her while I was gone. But it brought up a lot of emotion, because I had taken care of my father the same way and had to watch him pass on. It was very hard and very emotional. So I was going through all these different emotions while I was there.

It was overwhelming. And it’s hard to explain to someone what we experienced even in San Antón, because that was probably the most pivotal point in my journey.

There were a lot of places that were incredible. O Cebreiro was another one. Hiking there, I felt so much emotion during the Mass there. They had everybody read the pilgrim prayer in their own language.

Danny

Oh, you mean O Cebreiro?

William

Yes, O Cebreiro. Someone from Germany would say it in German, someone from Australia would say it in their own accent, someone from South Korea would read it in Korean.

Then a woman from Ukraine stood up. She became so emotional she couldn’t get through it, and people helped her. She was in tears the whole time. She was clearly going through something very painful. Maybe she lost her husband or family. I don’t know. I just felt for her. It was hard to hear her.

In a way, it was like self reflection. On this journey, it’s just very hard to describe the emotions you go through as you walk the Camino and the people you meet. It’s incredible.

Danny

Because actually, you didn’t sign up for the Inner Camino.

William

No, I didn’t sign up for any of this. I thought I was just going on an adventure, and look what it turned out to be. So much more.

That’s probably why I looked confused to you, because I was so shocked. This was something I did not expect at all. It completely took me over.

And I tell this to people. Some people are really intrigued and want to do it. Others get that glassy look in their eyes and don’t want to hear any more. So whenever I meet someone who is willing to listen, I feel like I’m some kind of disciple telling them all about this Camino experience.

I just go on and on because it was so powerful, so emotional.

And the hosts were so kind. They took us on that tour. We saw the wise man’s house, it was like a journey through art and exhibits and words that really meant something. Everything we read was emotional to me.

The nuns, the candlelight, everything was just so hard to describe. There was no electricity. We sat there by candlelight and had soup made from vegetables we had cut ourselves. And it was enough. It was really enough. It was so heartwarming to spend time with those people in that place.

And for some reason, we had exactly the right people there. We all came together, and we even had an interpreter. I forget her name, but I saw her a few times later on the trail. She talked about you and the things you were doing, and you almost became a story in yourself because I ran into other people who had met you. They were so excited about what you were doing. I said, “Yes, that’s Daniel. That’s my friend.”

Danny

I noticed that too. You know, Bill, I started my Camino in 2013, and in 2014 I got married on the Camino. Our honeymoon was walking the Camino, and that was where the idea first came to us to one day have our own albergue.

That’s why I was walking last year, from Saint Jean. For me, taking that step felt so logical and natural. Then I met people and simply told my story, and people got really excited about it. Then I started meeting other people who said, “Oh, you’re the guy.”

For me, it felt like nothing special, because it had already been in the making. But I was still totally flabbergasted by what it meant to other people.

William

It meant so much to me. I don’t know how to describe it. And like you said, the power places, San Antón, O Cebreiro, and the Iron Cross where I left two rocks for my parents who had passed away, it was all so emotional.

Different moments along the trail, I would just start crying, sometimes for no clear reason. It would all come up.

Danny

And how was it for you meeting other pilgrims? What was that experience like?

William

I met so many interesting people. Everybody had a story or a reason for doing this Inner Camino.

There was Ricky. I learned a lot from him. He’s a deacon in North Belfast, Ireland. I walked with him after we met at San Antón, probably for a couple of days. Before he came on this journey, he had been in a cancer hospital, praying with people who were on their deathbeds. So he had seen a lot of death, but he didn’t see it that way. He saw it as people moving into the next journey.

He was a very interesting person. He would read everything during Mass, and he had it in English, so I could follow along on his phone. I went to a lot of Masses when I was with him.

Then there was Christian. I met him one day. I didn’t know at first that he was gay, but later I learned he had a husband. Someone had wished me a happy birthday, and Christian said, “Let me buy you a coffee and tell you my story.”

So we sat down, and he told me his story. He was carrying the ashes of his husband in a small necklace. His husband had passed away. They hadn’t been able to do the journey together. His husband had wanted to, but wasn’t a big hiker. So Christian was doing the journey as if they were together, and in a way to let him go. Very similar to The Way.

Just incredible people I ran into.

Then there was Mary from Paris. I met her before I met you. She would sing in the churches. I remember thinking she must have been in a choir, because her voice was really good. Later she told me she had indeed sung in a choir. She loved the music and would sing whenever she was in a church. She was walking with a group of people, and I walked with them for a little while too.

It was just an amazing journey, and I would highly recommend it to anyone.

Danny

Why? I mean, you have the emotions and the encounters, but is that enough reason to walk the Camino?

William

You learn about yourself. It’s almost like self reflection.

You still carry pain, but I found I could carry it differently. And when I was walking with Father Ricky, he used the metaphor of the backpack. I was getting shin splints and was almost ready to quit. I had a lot of pain in my legs. He told me, “You’re going to empty that bag.”

And it became a metaphor. You carry only what you need, and you let go of what you don’t need. That was very helpful to me. Metaphorically, you shed the things you’ve been carrying for too long, and just keep what you need to get by.

In the simplest form, it was just walk, rest, eat, and begin again. It brings life down to the simplest things, what we need and what we don’t need.

That’s why I recommend it. Because it becomes a self reflection of your own self. People learn a lot about themselves, and it helps them move forward in life.

Danny

You know what I like about the English language? You can play with words. The podcast is called the Inner Camino Podcast, and it is a self reflection podcast by pilgrims, for pilgrims.

You can split “self reflection” into two parts, self and reflection. I’m Dutch, and in Dutch we don’t have that same ability to create an extra meaning with words.

And when I was writing the script for the introduction podcast, I came to a revelation. Self reflection is a skill, not a talent. That means everybody can learn it.

And the skill of self reflection also brings you to a place where you don’t judge yourself so much anymore, because then you start to understand why you did what you did. Maybe you would choose differently now, but you don’t stay stuck in self condemnation. You understand why. That’s the difference.

That’s the power of self reflection. You become more of an observer of yourself, and you move toward non judgment.

I’m a big fan of the Conversations with God books by Neale Donald Walsch.

William

Yes.

Danny

He writes a lot about the observer and about unconditional love. He says that when you do not judge the why, you can still judge the how.

Sometimes you do need to stop what someone is doing because it is harmful to others. You need to stop the behavior. But if you do not judge the deeper why, then there is no judgment, and that absence of judgment is perceived by the other person as unconditional love.

And while writing the script, I realized how powerful that is. Walking alone for six weeks on the Camino, which I had not done before, brought that home to me. I had done shorter walks of sixty kilometers before, which were beautiful and had magical moments. But on a long walk, alone, you are confronted with things and you cannot run to anyone with them.

That was one of the big revelations of the Camino for me last year.

Walking the Meseta, I noticed a pattern. The first hour, my body was just adjusting to walking again. Then, once my body settled into the rhythm, all kinds of things came up. Things from the past, things people had done to me, things I had done to others.

Then, an hour or two later, I would reach the first café and have breakfast. And I noticed that the emotional charge of what had come up was gone. The memory remained, but the emotional weight had passed.

As someone with a long background in applied psychology, coaching, and workshops, I discovered that walking the Camino alone, especially the Meseta, was the most powerful and effective form of therapy or coaching I had ever encountered in my whole life.

I even said to my wife, “If this keeps going like this, you can put me in the mental hospital in Santiago because I can’t handle it.” But after a night, it passed, and then it became more celebratory.

So how was that for you, that part? Because for me that was a major discovery.

William

Yes. I also walked that part alone. There were very few people around, and it was so quiet.

And yes, I went through the same kind of thing. Some of the things you reflect on from your past suddenly stop mattering. You realize that maybe you have been holding on to things your whole life. Regrets, choices, paths you took. And while you’re walking, you start to see, no, it happened the way it happened. It’s okay. Everything is the way it was supposed to be, and you are okay.

You let a lot of those things go while you’re walking alone. You realize they are not things you need to keep holding onto. So yes, you let all that go.

Danny

What does that mean for you now? Because you walked last year, in September and October, just like I did. We were there in the same period.

When I arrived in Santiago, my wife drove all the way from Sweden in three days to meet me.

William

That’s amazing.

Danny

She was standing on the square. I met her there, and I was crying. Then after maybe ten minutes she said, “You’ve changed. I don’t know exactly what changed, but you’ve changed.”

So how was that for you?

William

Yes, I think my kids noticed a difference in me too. I had changed. I was more open, more willing to talk, less shut in, more outgoing.

It changed me in some ways. I’m more open to things now. If something comes my way, I’m willing to listen and be open to it.

Danny

So you mean less judgmental?

William

Less judgmental, yes. Less judgmental about other people’s decisions. That’s their journey. Everybody is on their own journey in life, and they all have their reasons. You don’t need to judge anybody.

Danny

And how is it with judgment toward yourself?

William

I am less judgmental toward myself too. I still have hard days. I’m still having a hard time with not getting up in the morning and going somewhere. So I go on walks, even in winter, and now that the weather is getting warmer I go on longer walks.

But I miss it. When I first got back, all I wanted to do was go back. I really went through Camino withdrawal. I guess it’s a real thing, because Andrea, who walked the last part with me, sent me some articles about it. And yes, I was definitely going through that.

I just wanted to walk again. I felt like I could let everything go and just go back on the Camino.

Danny

Yes. You were suffering from PCS, Post Camino Syndrome.

William

Yes, exactly.

Danny

A lot of people do. And I always warn people. When people ask me what I did, I tell them, but I have to hold myself back because I can go on and on. It was so fulfilling.

For me, it was living the real life, not daily life. That’s how I try to explain it. But I also warn people, if you go once, you’re hooked. You want to go back again and again. It’s not an addiction like a drug, but it is a kind of longing. A longing for non judgment and for being with people in that way.

So when do you want to go back? Do you see possibilities for that?

William

I was thinking about doing it not this year, but next year. I kind of have to figure things out with my wife’s situation.

She hasn’t gotten any better. She lost part of her memory, and she can’t remember normal things. So I’m just trying to figure out my life situation and what I’m supposed to do with the rest of it.

But I do believe I will go back. I just don’t know when. It could be something that just comes up, and then I go. But yes, at some point I am going back. I want to go back.

I have a craving to be on the journey again in some way, maybe not for thirty three days or five hundred miles or eight hundred kilometers, maybe something smaller, but I definitely want to experience again what we experienced on the Camino. It was very emotional, very heartfelt.

Danny

And how can you bring that experience into daily life? Is there a way to live some of that in ordinary life too?

William

I think you need to get away from everything and be stripped down to the bare essentials, carrying only what you need, and just go on the journey alone.

I really think it’s important to do these journeys alone, or maybe with one person who is just as committed as you are. But being on your own out there on the Camino takes you through an experience that is hard to describe. It becomes a self reflection of your inner self.

It brings life down to the simplest things, the things you actually need to focus on. You stop worrying about everything else. You just focus on the next day.

But you can also see how it already affects life after the Camino, because I’m less judgmental now, and more reflective. So yes, it already has an effect in daily life.

Danny

Yes. And something else I realized while writing the script for the introduction podcast was this: when we take that self reflection with us after the Camino, and we judge ourselves less, then automatically we judge other people less too.

We can still stop harmful behavior when necessary, but not condemn the deeper why behind it. And then other people begin to experience what we experienced, something like unconditional love.

William

Yes, exactly. I was just going to say that.

I feel like I spread that where I live now, because I talk about it all the time. One of the things we experienced in the ruins at San Antón, and what I actually wrote on the card there, was just one word: love.

The hosts were loving. The whole group there, sharing that meal under candlelight, it was love. Unconditional love for one another and for the journeys we were all on.

And I think if some world leaders walked this path, they would find that too, and maybe we would not be in so much war all over the world.

It was love from people along the journey, and that openness. And I bring that home. I just feel love toward people now. It really is open arms.

Danny

Yes. I compare it like this: if I’m sitting in a dark room and someone lights a candle on the other side of the door, I can see the light shining under the door.

So I compare people who have walked the Camino and encountered self reflection, non judgment, and unconditional love to that light on the other side of the door. People become curious when they see that light under the door.

That is just how we are as human beings. We are curious. So we open the door, and there you are, simply being yourself, doing your thing, not being judgmental anymore.

You do not even need to spread it actively. You do not need to preach it. If you are simply there, shining that light by being less judgmental, it will always affect other people.

William

Yes. That’s a lot of what we experienced on the trail. Coming together, saying the pilgrim prayers, seeing what people were going through, everybody had a story. It was amazing. Any person you met had a whole life story behind them.

And I hope this podcast can bring some light to those stories.

Danny

Oh yes. I’m so excited about the podcast, to share that with other pilgrims.

William

There are just so many different stories, so many different people I met along the way. Christian would have a great story to tell. I think I still have his contact details. I should connect him with you.

The last two weeks I walked with Andrea, and she was so helpful in getting through that final stretch. We were so close by then, but it was still emotional, the whole trip. Hard to describe.

Danny

Hey Bill, I think we can wrap up, but is there something you really want to share with fellow pilgrims, or with people who are thinking about becoming a pilgrim? Something you feel you really need to say?

William

Yes. Whenever I talk to anyone willing to listen, I tell them that this is an experience you will not find anywhere else.

You learn not only to love other people, but also to love yourself. It is self reflection. You learn to love yourself. And for everything you’ve done, you didn’t do anything wrong. You are who you are, and you need to love yourself first.

That is probably what I would tell people. You have to love yourself. And on the journey, part of that is letting go of a lot of things, a lot of feelings, and learning to love yourself. And then you learn to love others along the way.

The journey was something I will never forget for the rest of my life. It was a pivotal point in my life, and I would recommend it to anyone who is willing to take this journey for themselves.

Danny

Okay, Bill. Thank you very much. And like I said at the beginning, I was really excited to have you here in the first real episode with a pilgrim, because we actually met each other.

And what we experienced there in San Antón, with Chechu and Angela and the others, went in so deep.

William

Oh my word, yes.

Danny

When people ask me about last year on the Camino, that is the story I tell. And of course I also tell the story of how confused you were, because it was so beautiful to witness, and how you opened up there. And we really became friends as well.

I’m really grateful that you joined me here in the podcast.

Whether you are walking the Camino right now, or preparing for it, or perhaps you are back home, and maybe even suffering from PCS, the Post Camino Syndrome.

I hope that this podcast inspires you. And if so, do NOT keep it to yourself.

SHARE IT!

When you share this podcast, you ACTIVELY help spread the skill of Self-Reflection.

Every person who learns the skill of Self-Reflection begins to see people differently.

You may still question WHAT someone DOES.

But the judgment about their INTENTION starts to disappear. And you enter the realm of non-judgement.

And non-judgment is experienced as unconditional love.

That is how REAL change begins.

With you.
Then the people around you.
Your city.
Your province.
Your country.
Your continent.
And eventually,
the world.

That is why ACTIVELY spreading the skill of Self-Reflection, like an unstoppable virus, is SO important.

So please, do NOT just listen, but ACT on this call, and share it with as MANY people and on as MANY platforms as you can, TODAY.

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Thank you for listening, and Buen Camino.